That would be so cool.
I just really doubt Berg dies and if he does i think it is a Max decision. Personally I do not believe Adam is so blunt, as much as he says otherwise on here
Look forward for two weeks from now though.
All that being said, if Berg does die, I think it will be a cheap death and on top of THAT I wonder what Max would run, there are so many tricksy characters who are the COOL dudes. I need a straight face like Berg to keep this group grounded.
Following the religious philosophy of CoS, everyone, even Berg, had a path to follow in life. Their paths can end in a quick and sudden death or a long and complete one. Since this is a show, we as an audience want a cast of characters to follow, the primary being Berg because he has been the main character for quite a while. The biggest problem I noticed when these to facts intersect is that our main characters and entire plot-line can end disappointingly. That the the view being that this is a show. When it comes to philosophy of CoS, Berg was following the path that was laid out for him. He is apparently the reincarnation of Illnaval who had been serving the Tower. Now after being cast out when faced with the task of retrieving a key in the Devil’s Vault. The problem here is that with the method of retrieving the key, he was offered a deal which would require him to give up Tulpa. Seeing how for the longest time Tulpa gave Berg the power to essentially fight and literally survive every combat he has been in, you would probably expect Berg the character to disagree and maybe also Max too. We can talk about the implications of Berg giving away Tulpa, the primary is that he is literally normal and also in a way alone again. No more extra damage to every single attack. No more advice or knowledge bumps from Tulpa. Noone to understand the literal thoughts and feelings of Berg, something noone has really done. Tulpa was most likely suppressed this entire ordeal so no wonder he couldn’t give his opinion on all of this.
Essentially, Tulpa was becoming a part of Berg, with Berg wanting to kick out Tulpa in order to accomplish his mission that he did not doubt. Even though Tulpa was surpressed, I believe Tulpa did not just willingly leave Berg because of the forceful evicting via potion. AKA: You aint kicking me out of my house without the house being damaged. Now Berg is dead.
Congratulations, you let someone live in your house for many years and talked with him quite a bit. He helped you out A LOT and now that you decided to kick him out with the help of the police, that someone wont go willingly.
This is my view on things.
Went on tangent but still my response as a whole to your message and the events of the show.
This is a really interesting point of view - thank you for sharing!
I have a theory (or maybe its more obvious than I thought). Its been heavily hinted at (correct me if I am wrong) that Hassan could be potentially setting up for Berg’s sacrifice. Him “punishing” Ramus for wanting to save Sali seems to be connected to that in that if Ramus was willing to save Sali and not let him die, when it came time for Hassan to enact his plan to sacrifice Berg he knew Ramus was going to get in the way hence the reason Hassan was testing Ramus with Sali, someone that Ramus had not had as much history with. I have a sinking feeling that the city of brass is not Hussan’s end game at all. Since his first appearance way back in season 1 I have had him figured to be the “Big Bad”. I haven’t got the chance to catch the show yet due to work but it seems very polarizing and I am greatly looking forward to see what happened.
If he was railroading like you said, wouldn’t he need to do more prep?
If Berg is dead that means the orc tribes story is dead, the Tulpa story is further unresolved, Mod isn’t as important, the question wether Berg is a god is irrelevant, and the question/PLAYER GOAL of why berg suffers (Which you once made the focal point of the city of brass) is mute. I hope you can see how this is frustrating for a audience member. For me, bergs death hold no impact; there is no story there. You’ve said before the story didn’t start till episode 51 and I agree. So what dose that say about the way you tell stories? That 50 episodes don’t mean a thing.
It’s not about making sure every single thing lines up and makes sense. Some stories don’t end how you want, or clearly.
I’ve pointed this out before. Them playing DnD as a game and as a show can be conflicting when the sudden death of a main character without clear reason can appear to be a real problem. At the end of the day, Berg agreed to give away Tulpa, knowing Tulpa has been with him for a very long time. Out of character if Max didn’t know there would be repercusions for having Tulpa for such a time then that’s his fault, if there was a way to come to that conclusion in the first place.
And again, it was not just berg’s decision alone to have Tulpa removed but his companions too. Berg doesn’t make his own decisions. He’s aware that he’s not smart enough so he leaves a large variety of choices to his companions.
The entire season that is the character of Berg is not only the storys of everything Berg has done but what he has chosen to do. Berg has joined the Tower because he has nothing left. His friends are dead and he is being hunted. He was offered the choice to join the Tower and he did so. With the Tower, Berg followed what he was told to do with little further choice of his own, accepting this. He met Ramus, someone he trusted due to past experiences, and left the vast array of complex decision making to him because he trusts him.
Personally the moment where I believed Berg started to truly stop making his own decisions and let others do it for him was when he finally approached Utrix. Realizing he was facing death because of a squabble between 2 Sahir, Berg accepted that these things didnt matter and didnt care if Utrix killed him right then and there. After be allowed to live in exchange for another pointless task, Berg accepted it since there was no other choice, cementing the fact that his choice doesnt matter. One illithid invasion later and Berg finds himself out in the desert recovering from severe brain suction. Accepting that fact that he was in the middle of nowhere in the desert was quick and easy because not only he was a simple person but because he also didnt care. Its both of these that all he wanted was purely base instinct of survival, since if he cant do any complex thinking, just leave the worrying part to his companions. One agonizing trip later and Berg is back at the City of Brass with a new task by Hazan, to join the war agaisn’t both the alien invasion and against the city itself. Here, again, Berg just accepts that this is apart of his life and doesn’t give any input on the matter, back into the senseless slaughter. I want to point out that Kalimat’s reaction to all of this appeared so true to me, in horror of what was to be done that its also a wonder of the process how he finally came to accept it.
Long story short, Berg is given a task, fights the aliens, gets caught by his former master and finally kills said former master. Congratulations Berg, you managed to destroy your final connection to your bad past. No need to worry about getting hunted. Another reason less to make important decisions and leave them to your friends. Just do what your friends tell you is a good idea and care only about your direct safety.
Here’s the thing though, Berg caring for his direct safety only appeared one time in the entire City of Brass, when the Tower was under attack. Facing an entire army armed and fully equipped in both manpower and magic, Berg for once feared that if he did what he was told, to aid in the defense of the siege, he will die. It was only Ramus who came to the defense of the Tower with that wisdom save that turned Berg. This exact moment is proof that Berg has left the important decisions to his compatriots, even decisions that would put him in extreme harm. Instead of leaving Ramus behind for his own safety, Berg turned to face the entire army. He could of just pulled Ramus away from the siege but he didn’t, he fought on because those that make the important decisions (Ramus) decided to.
After the siege concluded, I didn’t see much of Berg complaining about this fact at all, showing how little Berg seemed to care about what could of happened.
Instead, because the siege went out well, noone in the party died, and Berg survived just fine, he didn’t seem to care much about how badly things could of been and blindly trusted the terrible decision it was to attack.
Then we have the whole scenario of berg receiving a new task to invade the Devil’s vault to obtain a key to capture the Immortals. With the possibility of the task becoming easier with the aid of the orc tribe, it was the groups decision, not Bergs, to go to the orc tribe. Here, Berg was trialed to see if he was the resurrection of Ilnaval and apparently he won the trial. Once again we see Berg not making any decision himself whether to accept or reject the fact that he is indeed this Destructor. Instead, he takes the option that everyone wants by assuming the title that is Ilnaval but still remaining indecisive by not choosing. Berg doesnt want to choose, he lets his friends and those around him choose for him, and if he was forced to choose himself, he would meagerly accept whats asked of him.
Well I just wrote a whole lot of text, how do I summarize all of it so it can be well understood? This whole character story that is Berg is not about the plot that is Berg followed, created, and strived for, but instead highlights the indecision that Berg has let consumed him and his life. By being indecisive in choices that matter, Berg has created a story not of his own by letting others decide for him. Therefore it has ended badly when he found himself in the Devils Vault, giving away possibly one of the only creatures that can maybe understand him, yet failed to do so, personally I believe his indecision.
How does this apply to the show and the in-character story-line? In the story, Berg has managed to let go of all his past chains, being the reincarnation of Azure Vortex and the tether that is his former master. He worried about the girl but when it came to the challenge to find her when she was lost, Berg didn’t chase when he was told to by Ramus. It was a goal of his to find out why bad things keep happening to him but lacked both the intellect and the will to make his own meaningful decisions that led to what can be considered his premature death. If he is not brought back from the dead and continues to be played by Max, Berg may indeed not be the Destructor but instead maybe some hardy soul in the reincarnation process carrying some especially bad Dharma, so bad in fact that led to this entire life of Berg.
What does this mean for the show and Max himself? This seems like more of a lesson. We all cared about Berg because he managed to survive so long, not because of the meaningful decisions he made. Some could say his choice to join the Tower was a choice but it wasnt, he had nothing left. Those moment when we were on the edge of our seat as Berg was on deaths door against an enemy much stronger than him was just that. As I was writing this entire text block I have come to accept Berg’s death, not because this half-orc managed to survive this cruel world for so long but because he failed to make the choices that matter.
Max was given the stats he rolled and he played it spectacularly as Berg. After living for so long, we can all accept this entire lifetime was a learning experience. The more you play D&D, the more you learn about the game! Don’t look upon Berg’s death as a sad and abrupt end but as a new beginning to something more!
Once again the will to write a simple response has turned turned into a greater reflection of the whole! Curses me who dares wishes to explain oneself for their actions!
Bravo Adam, bravo. This episode made me remember that Azriel was once warned by a priest (justice maybe?) that Berg could not die or else his dark passenger would be able to enter heaven. Now I have wait two weeks to see what this foreshadowing holds. I feel like a kid waiting for Santa to deliver my presents on Christmas eve. Thank you for making me feel that excitement! However, I feel the need to say:
When Tupla is in heaven - All’s right in the world.
If Berg lives, and Tulpa is gone then wouldn’t that most likely mean the Hammer becomes defuct as well? I’m shocked not one of them voiced the concern that hey, you might lost power to that awesome hammer if you give Tulpa away. Granted, he could find another weapon in the vault.
In my mind, Berg only made that choice for the chance to help save Ramus, not counting the peer pressure. Still, to give away a powerful entity like Tulpa just like that…
I hope theres a chance for Berg to live, for him to survive all these episodes, lose all those friends, endure so many crazy battles to only die to a shady devil deal…so bittersweet.
Berg did mention the Psychic damage IIRC.
I assumed Berg dying was going to be a requirement of unattaching Tulpa from his soul irrelevant of how long Tulpa has been traveling with him. There is a new spell in Xanathars that I wonder if Petal is trying to use called Soul Cage. That allows you to trap a soul after someone dies and then you can pretty much gain abilities and information by “exploiting” the soul. Ironically if the players wanted to be really meta an option for bringing Berg back could be Ramus using revivify without the diamond under the assumption when Berg became Illneval he became a Zealot Barbarian with all their abilities around cheating death. Whether Berg is dead or “dead” I’m sure the story will be interesting and can’t wait for two weeks. I will say seeing some of the unwarranted attacks on Adam makes me kinda hope Berg is actually dead with no bringing him back just so I can see everyone up in arms about a character they love dying. I really wouldn’t mind a middle ground where Max rolls up a new character and the next arc is the group going to heaven to get Berg back and trying to get Ramus’s soul back while they are there. Either way amazing story options going forward. My two cents is he is dead while the soul is being extracted and then he will be brought back very soon into the next episode and a roll will be made to determine how successful or how fucked up Bergs soul is by this process.
I think that’s a really cool option, especially since Adam recently talked about letting players change stuff about their classes.
Some of the abilities in there would be really fitting of Berg the character especially the level 14 one (Rage Beyond Death) when you go to 0 hit points you don’t go unconscious or die from death saving throws until your rage ends. It would suck losing his bonus action attack but would be offset a little by being able to deal an extra d6 plus half his level of damage to a target once a round.
I believe that sums up my feelings on this episode.
Awesome episode. Loved all the soft moves. They were so careful at the bridge but then w/ the deal like “um, sure. sounds good?” Haha.
If Berg doesn’t actually die, and somehow Tupla is still around/a thing (I know, two huge ifs there). It’d be really interesting if this “episode” shows Tulpa like how to get a free ticket to the Fountain and then is just like “O, you mean if I just let Berg die I got straight up there?!?! Amazing!”
I enjoyed you enticing the PCs with slight teases of things, though I guess we don’t quite know JP’s PC well enough to know what he’d immediately go for…
Have a nice break from this show, hope the prep holds out! Haha.
In the vault, you find what you desire the most.
Berg wants relief.
He got it?