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What Makes a RollPlay Show Fun to Watch?

RollPlay: General & Archives
#83

What got me into this and still gets me every time, is how no matter the system, the gm, or the cast, every rollplay show so far has overflowed with passion from all associates parties to the narrative being created together.

The passion you all have for what you do shows. Some shows are more filled with intense emotions and just emotional situations overall, but all shows have it. Once you get hooked on one thing, the next one follows.

For me, once the emotional rollercoaster had me signed up, what made me decide to never abandon ship, was how…well. You’re all just LOVELY charming and hilarious people on screen.

Thanks for everything you do guys. Adam especially, thanks for using your voice to tackle such important matters the way you do.

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#84

I watch Rollplay since the first show and the cast of Solum kept me watching each and every episode. I fell in love with Westmarches and Swansong. I loved Neals, Stevens and then Adams GM (Ebon was quite bad but fun for me because the cast had a good synergy).

The most memorable moments of Rollplay for me are funny things like slap someone with a crit to the face but also great plot moments like Sicarians Space-walk.

I think most important for me is a good group of player like Geoff, Jp, Gassy, Ryan that don’t take stuff to seriously. You also need a Wildcard like kaitlyn to add some flavour.

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#85

OK, hold onto your butts cause my reply is probably going to be pretty long. Anyone that thinks it’s only 1 or 2 things, or a combination of those 2 things, is frankly and idiot; it’s an amalgamation of all the things Adam Koebel stated, and more. Here’s what, in my opinion, the breakdown of each of the factors that make a RollPlay show great and what, I think, their “weight” holds:

System (1%) - Ok, this one is kind of a no-brainer, without a game system there is no show, but the game system ISN’T really all that important in making a RollPlay show great. The system just sets forth the rules in which the players (and the GM for that matter) are allowed to interact within the confines of the game. Want to break down that door? Ok, but to do so you’ll need to have X strength and roll a Y on a Z die. Sometimes the system states that you need specific class skills or traits in order to do some things, in an effect to make it so that every player CAN’T just do whatever comes to their mind; which is fine, cause playing with friends is nice. In the end though, the system just defines the rule set and that’s it; it’s like water, you can shape it to your needs and/or do without some of it (which is fine for the most part). I believe that for the most part, people don’t care WHICH system is being played, it just a matter of people getting used to the ruleset is all (the biggest change we’ve seen yet is RollPlay: Balance of Power, and that’s mainly just because of the different dice being used is all.)

DM/GM and Setting (50%) - Now we come to the REAL meat of the show. I put these 2 things together because RollPlay shows haven’t ever (to my knowledge) used pre-made game modules before so the DM/GM builds the setting, while also creating the foundations of the show’s story. I can already hear people’s responses now, and YES, the players ALSO contribute to the story and YES, their actions can/do affect the setting; but here’s my response to all of those people - the players can only knock down what the DM/GM has already setup and placed in front of them to begin with. This puts A LOT of burden onto the shoulders of the DM/GM. Not only do they have to come up with the world that the players are going to interact with, but they’ve also got to come up with all the eventual answers and tools that the players are going to inevitably ask and use (or in JP’s case: break). Weather these are in the form of simply things the DM/GM tells the players, or through the NPC’s they create, it falls upon the DM/GM to have at all times on hand. But don’t let that discourage you people from trying to become a DM/GM.

My opinion on DMing/GMing for the first time and some examples of DMing/GMing gone wrong PLEASE NOTE: the DM/GM examples I give ARE NOT being used as insults to the respective people, nor am I bashing said people’s ability to DM/GM either; I AM, however, trying to point out key things that DMs/GMs tend to run the risk of becoming problems. I DO, however, always suggest to people that are new to DMing/GMing to start out running at least 1 pre-made module (if not 2) for your first game in order to get a handle on it; all you have to do is look at JP’s DMing of RollPlay: Ehbon to know why (sorry for throwing you under the bus JP, but I DO hope you’ll try DMing again some time in a future show). For those hat never watched it JP made one of the classic new DM/GM mistakes, for which there are many, by trying to come up with a brand new ruleset without having ever DMed/GMed at all before. He’s not the first, nor will be the last, to suffer from this but will hopefully learn from this experience and improve upon his DM/GM skill set for future games. I’m also going to throw Neal under the bus while I’m at it, as an example of someone that’s DMed/GMed for groups before, but still has some problems. The following may seem to some as though I’m berating Neal, I’m not. The only reason why I’m as harsh with Neal as I’m about to seem, is because I was once SO LIKE Neal, and fell into the same trappings. Though it may not seem like it, I’m berating myself for how I ran past game before that Neal, unfortunately also, ran aground upon, and that more people will be WAY more familiar with, given that Neal’s games were captured for all eyes to see 1. His mapping was WAY too ambitious. It was WAY larger than what the game needed, with many places never being visited by the players, nor were they all fleshed out as they needed to be had the players even visited them, which leads to 2. The Directionless / Open World Conundrum. With large maps, and no clear set goal, or sense of urgency to get a goal done quickly, in the players’ minds, the players will just do fuck all and stall a game. We saw this with Geoff a lot (and I do mean A LOT…Sorry Geoff) - with hanging around town for a month to get some full platemail fitted, or journeying to multiple towns in order to sell looted armor, etc. 3. Is what I call “Loot Whores R Us.” He gave the players WAY TOO MANY magical (and WAY TOO OP in some cases) items. Whenever a player brought in a new character, they always seemed to have at least 1 magical item that they started out with. The problem with this rampant amount of OP magical items is that it makes encounters WAY to simple for players to overcome; which in turn will usually, after a few games of being too OP, players tends to end game groups because there’s no longer a challenge for them, or the DM/GM has to throw a large amount of monsters that are typically supposed to be WAY over the player’s level to even thing about taking on in the first place 4. Neal suffered from what is undoubtedly a DM/GM archetype that some DMs/GMs get too into the mindset of: The TPK GM mindset - him vs the players, that’s it. And it wasn’t a problem made by, or because of, the ruleset (2nd Edition, which is what I originally cut my teeth wit back in 91’ when I first got introduced to AD&D.) It’s just one of the types of mindsets that people have when they DM/GM a game, and usually players tend to end game groups because of this type of mindset.

Cast (30%) - The people that are part of the group is important, but even more so is the group dynamic - how well the group of players get along with each other and the teamwork that they impart upon the group. How much effort a cast member has put into crafting their characters is also important; from just how they think the character looks to the character’s backstory. If the players don’t look like they’re having fun, or don’t seem to be working together towards the common goal, then the audience isn’t going to be having as much fun watching the show. Resting grump/bitch face aside, if the cast composition isn’t right, then we don’t get to see the great acts of teamwork as we’d like to see. For example, look at RollPlay: Balance of Power. AGAIN, I’m not shitting on ANYONE here, I’m just giving examples of what I thought of each of the groups interactions and dynamics. These are just examples for future players, both on the show and part of the audience The reason why the vast majority of people liked Team Empire more than Team Rebel, is because of the player dynamic and interaction that Team Empire had that Team Rebel seemed to be lacking. With Team Empire, you had Jesse would would whip the other cast members up, and pull them into crazy situations, that allowed the cast members to come out of their shells and be so care-free. The group fed off one another and thus the group dynamic was so great. With Team Rebel: you had Zeke trying to feed back and forth with Anne (but the 2 didn’t really work together well off enough / didn’t play into enough), Cohh being the absent minded leader (which to his credit, he corrected later on in the show), and Kaitlyn just off doing her own thing (I get it, she was playing a rouge/loner character; but unfortunately that just doesn’t work well with a group dynamic is all). Yes, Team Rebel got better after a few episodes, but their group dynamic isn’t as great or as interwoven as Team Empire. Weather it’s gags, gimmicks, goofs, or just good old fashion teamwork; casting holds it role.

Epic Moments (14%) - These are the times when crits, both successes AND fails, get rolled. These are the times when players just go off the walls and do crazy things that nobody expected. This is when rolling dice stop being polite and start becoming epic. We’ve seen some crazy things happen on RollPlay; from breaking your enchanted bow to gaining a personal cloaking emitter, from saving a teammate about to die to dying in one turn without anything that the players could do. This is the “It Factor” that drives people to keep watching, because with just one roll of the dice, everything can change. You can’t plan for these, but without them, any show would just seem dull.

Community/Chat Involvement (5%) - Weather it’s taking names and/or ideas that the people watching type in chat or on a forum, drawing inspiration from the community bring those watching into the game by creating something that the group playing interact along side with. Love us or hate us; chat has both saved and damned players because of our fact checking/rule-lawyering/doing the math calculations for the steam. Personally, I don’t think we’re being utilized as much as we could be doing for the shows and can become a bigger tool for the show. Weather it’s from creating map layouts and dungeons layouts to having a team of fact checkers sitting on stand by in a Discord channel, the community can be doing so much more for the shows. One of the biggest drawbacks for most people DMing/DMing is just creating the physical representations of their world; and luckily many of us have prior experience and tools at hand that we can help out with some of this. I’ve ALWAYS hated it when DMs/GMs don’t use layouts for things like battles or dungeons, all the while saying they’d “rather have the players visualize it in their own heads instead.” That just fucking being a lazy DM/GM. You don’t need elaborate dioramas, or fully colored large print layouts with die cast figurines to play a tabletop RPG; hell, most of the time I played we’d just use grid paper, with the DM/GM drawing out what was around as we explored some diabolical dungeon. But since Roll20 HAS the built in ability to add pre-made layout creations, why not has some sub-forum on here that people can post their creations, or having a DM/GM make a post with a list of features that they want and then letting people submit their rendition of it that then gets used, or hell even just rough grid paper layouts that either the DM/GM can then make into a real full layout that the players then play on. As for the Discord thing, I think it’s a good idea for the DM/GM to have a group of community members that can then be on hand to look up rules, do calculations, or (dare I say) correct the DM/GM because of a mistake. This, of course, is the hardest thing to do, because the DM/GM would need to make sure that the people that are a part of this group know what they’re talking about and not just saying stupid shit (that’s already going to be said in show’s chat anyways.) And no, this isn’t me begging to be a part of it if it does come to happen. I would say that the Mods should be a part of said group, but they (the mods that is) are there to mod the channel, and shouldn’t be expected to learn each game’s system and ruleset. This group of people would also probably need to be changed often because of different game systems; someone that knows a shit ton about X isn’t going to know how game Y’s ruleset, unless they’ve played it before (or they might’ve played it before but not enough to have gained the same amount of experience as other games.) In the end though, even if it’s not as broad as having a spot for rule-laywering or looking stuff up for the DM/GM, I do think it’s a good idea to have a group of people on hand that the DM/GM can look towards to make sure the math is done right, rather than to rely on chat spam. I’m hoping that since JP has created this forum that the community can give its’ input more into the shows creation rather than just seen as a bunch of potential viewers. And if we ARE to be utilized through the forum, please don’t just post a general call to arms for people, and instead give us some direction. You want layout makers? Fine, give a list of the parameters you want it to include and then let US decide how it looks or how it’s layout is.

Here’s an example of what I’m talking about:
Size: No larger than X / and/or / No smaller than X / and/or / X number of rooms / and/or / X number of rooms that are Y size
Theme: (i.e. is this some stone built dungeon, or some mad mage’s tower, or some demonic temple, etc)
Traps: None / or / X number / and/or / this trap, this trap, and this trap, but not this trap / and/or / X number of any of these traps
Features to include: Fire Pit in the center of the main room

What you’re going to get back from people, like I said before, is either a mix of grid paper style rough layouts (which may be all the DM/GM needs or wants), fully colored maps with intricate details, or even simply nothing at all. And look, even as cheesy as the Kappa Kastle or the itmejpfist dungeon might seem, it’s still something that I’m sure that both the players group as well as the community are going to enjoy interacting with, I believe.

TL;DR - System (1%), DM/GM and Setting (50%), Cast (30%), Epic Moments (14%), Community/Chat Involvement (5%)

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#86

I’m really into story so the setting and cast usually gives me the best viewing experience. The performance of the cast really immerses me like in Dogs recently or with mirror shades and certain episodes of the WM. Silliness and jokes from the cast are usually the biggest things that keep me engaged and why I come back.

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#87

Geoff, Djwheat, Jp, AdamK, and Neal

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#88

Here’s a small list of what makes Rollplay enjoyable for me (not in any specific order)

  1. The type of game. I’m not talking about the system (that’s point 2) but rather if it’s going to be heavy combat or more focused on the RP itself. It’s a reason why I stopped watching Court of Swords, because it’s mostly focused around combat, which I tend to find boring unless there’s a narrative stake in it (other than the PC’s just dying). Swan Song did this brilliantly, where fights tended to become very important narratively and thus had a lot of tension, plus it was kind of rare, while with what I watched of Court of Swords, there have been a lot of fights where the only real stake was the characters dying, which to be honest, isn’t interesting, and if it happens a lot, it makes it even more tedious because then you will lack character growth.

  2. The system. To be honest, if I see another game that’s based around the Apocalypse engine, I’m out. Not because I think the engine is bad (because it ain’t), but because those systems tend to be very similar and thus somehow less interesting. Another thing is that a system can heavily compliment or actually subtract from what the players are able to do. Good example was the Dogs in the Vineyard one-shot, where the system gave the players a great tool to push the narration forward and define their characters.

  3. The cast. Not everyone is good at Roleplaying, and that’s fine, but it can take away from the enjoyment of the show. If you have a cast that works well together, compliments each other and aren’t afraid to take risks, you will most likely have a great story on your hands. But more importantly, you need a great cast with a system that they can actually work with, because it will enhance the experience even more. A great example is again last one-shot Dogs in the Vineyard where you had 4 great RP’ers (and a great GM) utilizing the system to push the narrative forward and create an awesome story and characters. It’s also why I adored Balance of Power Dark Side because they loved to take risks and create conflict with each other, while still being a group (Light Side was more of a group, but they were more reluctant to take risks and thus I felt their hardships would mostly be created by the GM, which was less interesting for me. Not saying btw that the Light Side group was bad at RP, because they weren’t, but the Dark Side was just way more interesting and entertaining to watch) As it comes down to GM’s, well, seeing as it’s been mostly Adam lately, all I can say is that yes, the GM is very important, but that has never really been a problem of the Rollplay shows.

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#89

The cast, but specifically the kinds of characters they play. Court of Swords started out with a good cast, but everyone played characters that were boring. When the party wiped, everyone made new characters that were much more fun/interesting (I’m a big fan of Geoff’s, and him joining is always entertaining, but everyone else also got wayyyy more entertaining too). I think this is why most people enjoyed CoS a lot more after the party wipe. In DND, the DM provides the potential for fun/interesting things to happen, but ultimately it’s the players and their characters that will make things fun/interesting.

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#90

First baseline: good audio quality. I mostly listen to mp3’s at this point, and will stop listening if someone has bad audio (less a problem for Rollplay than Roll20 shows).

After that:

  1. I really enjoy shows I can miss episodes for and still watch live or catch up quickly. West Marches was perfect for that, and R&D was also usually short enough I could catch up. I enjoyed what I saw of Mirrorshades and Swan Song, but once I got behind I struggled to catch up, which was discouraging because I really like watching live. If more shows could have clearly defined archs or some brief recap, that’d be helpful. (CoS for example, I jumped back in after the TPK because it allowed for a reboot of the story line).

  2. Diversity in GM’s. I really, really like Adam’s style, so this is no knock against him. I think a variety of GM’s keeps the different shows feeling fresh. The months between losing Steven and gaining John definitely caused me to stay less plugged into shows in general.

  3. Players who are invested in the system for what is, whatever system you play. I faded off Saga of the Icelanders pretty quick back in the day because it felt like the players didn’t “get” the system and struggled for a while to embrace it for what it is; conversely, the cast for the Masks one shot fully embraced that system.

  4. Cast chemistry, as everyone is saying. I really enjoy shows with the 20-30 minutes of chatter at the beginning, because it usually means the cast is friendly, engaged with each other, and having fun. With that, I’m a big fan of cast diversity, and the one shots are filling this niche for me really well because it allows for some variety each month.

  5. Just a personal taste preference, but I enjoy shows which have room for silliness and weird over-the-top stuff (like Sicarian jumping on the pirate ship early on, or Cohh’s character in West marches carrying around his dead brother).

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#91

To me the most significant factor is the cast. Pretty much everybody that has been a cast member has done a wonderful job. Even the ones that haven’t roleplayed before are fun after they get some experience and settle into their role/character. Having said that, the ones with the “biggest” personalities and the ones that come up with off the wall in-game ideas often make the best cast members.

That’s not to say the GM isn’t also very important, and maybe with the three (so far) main GM’s Rollplay has had I have been spoiled. I could be devaluing a good GM to a certain extent because Neal, Steven, and Adam have all done a wonderful job.

If the setting and system aren’t too outrageous or unfair, then I’m good. I tend to prefer Dungeons and Dragons as the system, but that mainly due to having been exposed to D&D the most. As long as the GM and cast like the system then ultimately it is of lesser importance.

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#92

what’s funny to me is that this is the exact opposite of the criticism I got running SWN. I try to reiterate this stuff a lot, but it’s the system we’re playing - I play by the rules, as do all the players. it’s not that I go out of my way to get a specific result, it’s that the games work a specific way and 5e is super lethal at early levels.

6 Likes
#93

These are all such great responses! Thank you for your feedback, y’all.

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#94

Obviously we all love a good laugh, but my absolute favorite moments are when the PCs are so involved with their characters that they become emotionally vulnerable. Swan Song was especially successful at creating these moments. I don’t know what it’s like being a big time Twitch streamer, but for a lot of us we consider you guys (the streamers) friends. We’ve been watching many of you for years, after all. It’s sort of special when I get to see a PC that I feel close to show emotions that they otherwise don’t during a normal stream geared towards being cheerful and entertaining.

A bit strange, I know. But hey, it’s honest.

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#95

This is what I always remember most about campaigns. The raucous laughter is fun and stuff, but it’s the moments where we’re sitting wondering what we’re learning about each other and the world through the stories we’re telling is what matter most to me. Whether it’s Geoff and I discussing death through Pi and Sicarian or Wheat and Dodger working out what it would mean to love someone obsessed with a dangerous habit, or just JP and Steven navigating the always-tense waters of character disagreement - that stuff is what I live for.

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#96

I think the roleplay shows are most fun when the cast is comfortable with each other and with the game because if they don’t understand how the game works or are trying to not to get in another cast members way it stifles the character and the player, roleplay is at its best when the cast and characters aren’t afraid to disagree with each other (whether out of avoiding conflict or not being aware of other in game options) and have to confront a hard decision as a group instead of just sitting passively in the world as 1 or 2 people make all the decisions

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#97

I’ve enjoyed watching all of the recent RollPlay shows, the cast on every one has been fantastic, they really seem to get invested in their characters, a great DM and interesting and compelling scenarios.

Honestly though I found the recent Dogs In The Vineyard difficult to get into, the cast was brilliant and Adam you did a great job as usual. I thinks it was because I wasn’t sure I completely understood the system that was being used and found it difficult to follow exactly what was happening.

1 Like
#98

The first several eps of west marches were a slaughter house with all the level 1 characters.

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#99

GM, Cast synergy, visualisation and knowledge around the game system makes or break the show for me.

  • The GM’s ability to tell a story and create universe that feel lived in.
  • The cast needs the have synergy with each other and with the GM.
  • Knowledge about the game system, drives me mad when cast members are many episodes into the show and still haven’t bother learning the basic rules. Drags out so much of the show.
  • How the GM visualizes the world, maps, battles and so on are very important for me. Especially in combat were ranged matters.
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#100

I think rollplay is most interesting when players are put in situations they haven’t thought about before.

If you put a group of players in a standard DnD situation where they start in an inn and have to clear a nearby cave of goblins then the players know the motions to go through. With this type of story they’re sort of free form rping a generic fantasy storyline salted with whatever characterization is floating around in their head. This is boring. We’ve all read the stories and watched the movies and while tropes can be a useful shorthand they can also be a crutch.

If you put the player in a more surreal situation I think they get to live in their character more and can be asked to make more interesting situations. What if that village the players start at was farming the goblins for food and one pack happened to get away and setup in a nearby cave? Will the players wipe them out (they will because dnd but that’s a different issue) or will they confront the villagers about eating their eating habits?

To be more specific, I did not enjoy BoP Light Side. Because, while I like all the players individually, I found their decision making predictable and dull.

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#101

I would say satisfying arcs? Both character and story-wise.

This is why I kept tuning in to the Swan Song GM Turn, because I wanted to know, will Onintza Libre survive ? Will Andoni rise from the ashes?

Swan Song was full of these. How twisted will PI become? Will Piani be able to raise PI? Will Victor meet a Shindalien? Will Willbur be able to pull off “The Higgs” again? And most of all, will Mr. Siccarian topple Mr. Titan and return to his rightful place at Phothenhauer?

Similarily in West Marches, will we ever know what would Hextia do with Julliete’s baby? Will Kurthak be able to defend his adopted family? Will Kellan earn the respect of his father? What will become of Grigori? Will Galahan get his dragon egg hatched?

On the other hand some of the shows were mixed bag for me, mostly because I often didn’t find an arc that I really cared about.

I.e. in Mirror Shades only CrusherXHadyia really clicked with me. In Balance Of Power I loved the first episode, and really liked the system, but no arc really clicked with me as well.

2 Likes
#102

For me:
The Cast - there are certain people who are/have been on Rollplay that I love to watch, and some I just can’t get behind. It’s a personal thing. But in the end the cast of a show determines whether I watch a small portion of a show or the whole series.

The DM - This is always a big thing for me, but something that hasn’t been an issue for me on Rollplay shows recently. Loved everything from Adam and Steven, and haven’t seen John Harper DM, but loved him in Adams Apocalypse world on Roll20.

The Setting - For a one shot, I really love seeing new settings, for an extended show I love seeing arcs for both the characters and the Setting itself.

One thing with setting that I’d like to see is a long running setting with characters going from “I’m gonna die” upwards to “We can kill a god now”. But I think that style might be better for a group off stream over a show. Although I’d also like to see a full on Anime style campaign with Dodger GMing :itmejpcrit:

Ruleset - Doesn’t really affect my viewing experience so far, as long as the DM knows the system and the players pick up on it and don’t hate it, it’s fine. That being said, I’d love to see more rulesets over the next few years.

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